Hi, it’s Patrik from INTENSIVECAREHOTLINE.COM where we instantly improve the lives for Families of critically ill Patients in Intensive Care, so that you can make informed decisions, have PEACE OF MIND, real power, real control and so that you can influence decision making fast, even if you’re not a doctor or a nurse
in Intensive Care!
This is another intensivecarehotline.com Podcast and in the last Podcast episode we published another client interview and client testimonial.
Podcast: My Mom Died In ICU. Why Has The ICU Team Denied My Mom Of Care And Life-Sustaining Treatment?
You can check out the last podcast here.
In this week’s episode of the INTENSIVE CARE HOTLINE Podcast, I want to share the experience from one of my clients Lisa as part of my 1:1 consulting and advocacy service!
Lisa lost her husband last year in ICU and Lisa thinks that the hospital euthanised him.
Lisa’s story can be a lesson for someone that has a loved one in ICU and be on high alert to question everything that the intensive care team is telling them and seek out experienced professionals like us here at Intensive Care Hotline that can advocate for you before it’s too late.
You can listen to the Podcast here or read the transcript below.
Podcast: They Gave My Husband Morphine in ICU to his Death and Seeking out Consulting & Advocacy Service with Intensive Care Hotline Early Could Have Saved his Life!
Patrik: Welcome to the intensivecarehotline.com podcast. Intensive Care Hotline helps families of critically ill patients in intensive care to improve their lives by making informed decisions, have peace of mind, control, power, and influence.
Thank you, and welcome for listening to another episode of the intensivecarehotline.com podcast.
I’m your host, Patrik from intensivecarehotline.com and today I have a very special guest with me, today I have Lisa with me. Hi, Lisa. Welcome to the podcast and thank you for coming on. How are you?
Lisa: I’m good, how are you?
Patrik: Very good, thank you. Lisa, you have reached out to us in the last week or so with what I believe is another very sad story. And unfortunately for me, this is not a novelty because we hear about these stories over and over again. I have seen it many times in intensive care myself. And I’m really very grateful that you can share your story with me and our listeners today because I think it really serves as a stark warning. And I’m very
happy that you can share your story and hopefully our listeners will take away something from it. Lisa, why don’t you start with what you’ve experienced in the last six months or so.
Lisa: Okay. My boyfriend/husband of 11 years, we considered ourselves married. We’re common law married. He had COPD. He had heart disease and high blood pressure and kidney
disease. And on August 21st, he woke me up and said that he needed to go to the hospital because his oxygen level was fluctuating between 88 and 92 or something like that. So I get up and took him to the hospital. And we got there and they gave him breathing treatment. And did an EKG and x-rays, I think. And then some blood work. And his blood… The nurse came in and said that she needed his blood work to tell whether he was going to be admitted or not. So she comes back in and
said, “Yeah, that his arterial blood gases were up really high and that they were going to have to intubate him”. Well, he’d been intubated last January for the first time, so we knew what was going to
happen.
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Lisa: So I had to leave the room, but before I left, the doctor came in and he asked who I was. And James told him, “That’s my wife.” Well, then the doctor said, “Do you want to be resuscitated if something happens”. We both suggest, “Do everything you could do”. James could’ve said that. But then I left. First, I went up to find out when I could see him in ICU and how often everything. Then I left and came back that afternoon, because there was
only a half hour visit in the morning, in the afternoon and two in the evening. And it had to be the same person every time for that 24 hours. So I’m back and he was intubated. He was kind of restless, though. We went around to that and asked them about that and they said, “Well, they didn’t want to put you out”. I said, “Okay”.
Lisa: Nobody mentioned to me that they lost his pulse or that he had heart failure or anything. My phone number, it was even wrote on the board, in the ER, in case anything happened, nobody contacted me. Then the nurse came in, tell me he was all right and all that. And that they might try to take him to
a breathing test in a day or two, or whatever. But then the next day, because I’m going there every day three or four times a day, he was still restless. And when I got there, the nurse said that about 5:00 AM that morning, he got restless and pulled that tube out and put it back in. He wasn’t sedated enough. But they put it back in and I guess they upped his sedation a
little bit, not enough though. He was still restless. And so then his oxygen level and everything looked pretty good, but his vent was only at 80%. So, he was breathing 20% at the time? Is that how it goes?
Patrik: 20% is room air. 21% is room air. So the air that you and I are breathing is 21%.
Lisa: Oh, okay. Well, and they said that he got a fever the second day. About 103. They said that his blood was thrown back too, but they didn’t know why. Then he had a lot of fluid built up in him that was coming up, but he would squeeze their finger and open his eyes when they asked him to. And he was only sedated at 15 MCGs, or whatever at that time. And on 8/23, he was slightly better with no fever. And it’s vent with down to 70%. And his
oxygen was right around 95 or so, which is pretty good for him, because his breathing weren’t so bad to begin with. But he seemed restless.
Lisa: They were going to take the meds. They could feed him intravenously. And they said that probably the next day they would try to do a breathing test. It’s okay. And that’s the first time that anybody mentioned to me that they lost his pulse in the ER. He didn’t heartburn, he just said, “Oh, I think they lost his pulse for a little bit”. To me that meant passed out or something, not heart failure. They had to do CPR on him. Well then on 8/24,
he was still restless. He grabbed the nurse by the arm and pulled her arm down. So then they upped his sedation again. They didn’t want to give it to them for some reason. But his vent down to 60%. And on 8/25 he was going on and on. But his blood pressure all the way up to 8/25 is normal for him.
Lisa: His blood pressure would run 150 over 90 usually. His oxygen was looking pretty good, because he’s on the machine. Paul said he was looking good. Around 8:25, when I got there, the vent was at 60%, but his blood pressure was down to 127 over 63. And I asked why and they said, “Oh, it’s just this medicine”. Well, then that didn’t look right to me. Then the next day they did a breathing test on him. And I actually was there that time. The only
time I was there during a breathing treatment, I walked in on it. He talked to my grandson and my grandson asked me, “Are you going to get better up on, come with me and grandma?” He said, “Yes”, he shook his head “Yes”. He was alert. He was awake.
Lisa: He was doing good. But then the visitation was over. So I left and I come back later on. And they said that his breathing got labor again, so they put them back on the vent. I said, “Okay”, but his blood pressure was down there at 100 over 58 by then. But the event was at 50%, really low for him.
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Patrik: Right. And we are now we are now, just for timelines, we are now two days into ICU. Is that right?
Lisa: Yeah, we’re four/five days in.
Patrik: Okay.
Lisa: Well, then a couple of days after that I came in. No, the next day I think I came in and I asked to see the doctor, because the doctor was never there when I go in, because they had to put it back on the vent. I wanted to know if that was normal, the doctor said, it was normal to have a setback like that. And I said, “Okay, what’s going to happen”, he said, “We’ll just keep trying to do tests on him every day. And when he gets strong enough
we’ll take the tube out”. So, I said, “Okay, looks good”. Well that day his blood pressure got real low again and I kept asking, “Why is his blood pressure so low”, “Oh, it’s his medicine”, “Why aren’t you adjusting it then”, “Oh, he’s all right. He’s all right”.
Lisa: If we come in and do a breathing treatment, then they took the little thing with the liquid in it up. They leave that vent wide open. He kept saying, “He’s got a fever, he’s got a fever”. Couple more days and they kept trying to… It would be four visitation hours, but they would say, “He was responding to us. He would squeeze our fingers and he’d open his eyes, but his breathing was too late. Put him back on the vent”. Never when I was there
though. He just kept saying, “He wasn’t strong enough, there’s labor or his gases were too high and there’s blood therapy”. Then on the 10th or 11th day a different doctor. The doctor over the ICU came in. He was over all of it. He came in and he said that he thought we needed to start talking about getting him off the vent.
Lisa: I said, “What do you mean”. He said, “Well, we don’t know if there’s brain damage and he can’t stay on the vent forever”. I said, “Well, we’re not even going to discuss it until I know whether he’s brain dead or not”. So, he said, “Well, okay, I’ll order the test tomorrow. I’ll have more tomorrow”. And so then the coordinator that came in, she asked, “Were you guys married?” and I said, “We consider ourselves married. And he told them in the
ER that we were married, been together 11 years. I said, “I had a medical directum, but we never got around to signing it”. And so she said, “Well, you can bring in anything, so you two considered yourself married. That’s fine”. I said, “Yes, disability. He said that his spouse might have made them not qualify”. We had titles, the cars and everything else. So I took him through, but that doctor, apparently, didn’t like that I told him “No”.
Lisa: He says that we didn’t have to see him at all. Since I’ve known him, neither one of them had gone to the hospital to see him period. So they go in there, they don’t bite on their nothing. In the meantime, James taken off the vent for two hours and he said he handled it, but there was labor, they said, so they put it back on. And they did the brain test. His brain was fine. He had normal brain activity. And then they called the family in and
wanted to know if they could take the tube out.
Patrik: And, and sorry, can I just interject there, just for our listeners, to clarify taking out the tube. What did they tell you? What would be the result of taking out the tube? Were they clear in the outcome or was it ambiguous? What the outcome would be if they removed the tube.
Lisa: They said that either he would continue breathing on his own and if he was breathing on his own perhaps, or they take them downstairs to another room and put a PAP on him and let him breathe on his own, or he could just stop breathing.
Patrik: Right. So basically a sink or swim approach.
Lisa: Yeah, basically-
Patrik: You and your family were aware that if they took out the breathing tube, that it would be a sink or swim approach?
Lisa: They were aware, but they were… I was thinking that you could handle it on his own was what I was thinking. They were not budging his family. They were just like, “He wouldn’t want to be living on that machine”. And the doctor painted the picture, like as if James would never get off that ventilator, that
he would have to go to a nursing home or something. Just be on the ventilator the rest of his life. Oh painted the picture really bad.
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Patrik: Yeah. Okay.
Lisa: The deal was… The doctor said that if he breathing on his own for more than 30 minutes, they would take him downstairs.
Patrik: And put him on CPAP. Just for our listeners, I need to clarify for our listeners what CPAP means. Basically what Lisa is describing, that her husband was on a ventilator with a breathing tube. The ICU team wanted to take out the breathing tube, do a sink or swim approach, which means he’s either going to breathe and then would end up on CPAP. CPAP is basically ventilation with a face mask, or the sink approach is he wasn’t breathing and would basically approach his end of life. Sorry, Lisa, I just needed to clarify that for the listeners.
Lisa: Yeah, that’s fine. But they didn’t say nothing. I don’t think they said anything about morphine shots, nothing real then.
Patrik: Right.
Lisa: Well then the next day they were supposed to pull the tube out, because I was like, “Yeah, there is no, Oh no, I didn’t mean to do that”. When he’s gone, he’s gone. But I was hoping and praying he could breathe on his own. So the next day it was set up that it was like the 17:00 that evening. We’ll come 17:00. His mom actually came in to see him and she was surprised, because the doctor was saying that he wouldn’t respond. He wouldn’t move
his arm to legs. He hadn’t moved in 20 days. They didn’t try to sit him up. They put a wedge under his back twice. He had a big old sore on his cheek, because they never moved that thing that holds the tube in. They put wedges underneath his ankles, but they beat him three or four days. They didn’t move him at all. So I was like, “What did you expect them to do after that long?”.
Patrik: How many days, Lisa, I missed that. How many days was he intubated at that stage? How many days are we talking about?
Lisa: 21 days.
Patrik: 21 days. And all that time he was in an induced coma.
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Lisa: Yeah.
Patrik: Right.
Lisa: Except for the one time when he talked to my grandson.
Patrik: Right, but even the day before they took out the breathing tube, he was in an induced coma.
Lisa: Yeah.
Patrik: Okay. So, they never gave him a chance to really wake up.
Lisa: Nope. Today it took about 10 minutes for the doctor to get there and the doctor would go in and say, “Oh, he’s not responding”.
Patrik: Sure. Well, fair enough.
Lisa: Not a word was mentioned about a tracheostomy or nothing. None of that.
Patrik: Did you only find out about the trach after this all happened?
Lisa: Yeah.
Patrik: So you had no idea that a trach might be an option?
Lisa: No.
Patrik: Right. So the intensive care team potentially misled you and your family from the very start.
Lisa: Yes.
Patrik: Right. Okay.
Lisa: Well the next day at 17:00, well then they decided that he could be an organ donor. So they put it up and they, started testing him and everything for that. And then his son kind of flipped out and said that I couldn’t go to the hospital and all this other stuff. But the next day I finally got in to see him and his son said, “Well, let her decide whether to take the tube out”. Nope. He wouldn’t even come up to the hospital. He still hadn’t
seen his dad. Well, when I got through that date, the tube was like almost completely out of his mouth.
Lisa: And just fell out of his mouth before. This tube was like three inches out. And he seemed to be like gagging on it. But he also was wriggling like he was in pain when you lift his arm, lift his leg. So I told him, “You know what, 11:30 take it out. It’s almost out anyway and he’s gagging on it. Just take it out”. So they took it out, but they left his oxygen tube on his nose. So I assumed it was on. Apparently it wasn’t. And he was breathing
on his own. He was doing pretty good. His oxygen was fluctuating between 92 and 96, 99. But the nurse came in right after he took the tube out and gave him two shots of morphine to keep him comfortable. I said, “Okay”. And the night before the organ donors, the people that were going to pick up the organ were there at the hospital, supposedly. They flew in.
Patrik: Okay. Can I just clarify here, Lisa, was your husband or any of your family members consenting to him being an organ donor? Was that part of the discussion?
Lisa: His mother and his son.
Patrik: They consented to him being an organ donor?
Lisa: Yeah.
Patrik: Right.
Lisa: I knew that he wanted to donate his organs if he ever got hit in an accident or something.
Patrik: Sure.
Lisa: When the doctor came to meet with him, they kept saying, “My uncle, you’re my uncle” or, well, would be his mother’s adopted son. He was on the machine, kept alive and they took him off, but he died. My dad said he never wanted to be like that. His uncle, or his brother, was brain dead. He’d been breathing for four weeks when they finally took him off the machine. James wasn’t brain dead.
Patrik: No he wasn’t. You can still donate organs, even if you’re not brain dead, if you are in an end-of-life situation. But I should just probably say, on this note, it sounds to me like he was breathing by himself after they took the breathing tube out. He had some oxygen and then they were giving him morphine. Basically the main side effect of morphine is respiratory depression, which means any sort of breathing efforts would have been
diminished by the morphine. Now, if that’s what led to his passing that, I would consider, as euthanasia.
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Lisa: Yeah. I asked, because he had gas or something and I went, I asked her, “Can you give him a Tums or something?” “Oh no, no. That’s not the direction we want to go in.” “I see. What direction do you want to go in?” “Where he passes, quietly” “What?! You’re putting them to sleep like a dog?!”.
Patrik: That is euthanasia. I should just clarify here for our listeners what euthanasia is. Euthanasia is the hastening of death and it’s considered illegal in most Western countries. I would say in all Western countries, it is considered illegal and I just leave it there and I’ll let you continue.
Lisa: Yeah. Well then we sat there and I sat there with him and his breathing went up to about 35 a minute. I would tell him, “Breathe deep, breathe, deep. Bring it back down, bring it back down”. It was 33, 30 right around there. His oxygen was doing really good. They get down to like 94, 92. But if we bring it back up to 99. Post was really bad, but not that bad. Blood pressure was pretty good. I went after to ask about the times when she told
me, “Oh, that’s not what we want to go”. And then she comes in there…
Lisa: Oh no. I asked her to suction his mouth out, because I got him a sponge on a thing to put water in his mouth and he was biting down on it. And he was looking right at me the whole time. And then about 15:00 I went in and went out, asked her to suction some of the slime out. Well, she had that thing down his throat. I felt bad. She went out, she come back and with two more sucks, I said, “what’s that? Morphine?” I said, “Why does he need more
morphine?”. You just gave it to him. “Because that’s what the doctor ordered”. I said, “Okay”. So then she did. Boom! His oxygen level went down to 70, blood pressure dropped. So I went out there and I asked her “What’s going on? Why’d it drop so bad?”, “Well, that’s direction we want to go”. She came in and she set the monitor off so I couldn’t see.
Patrik: Well, was your husband conscious when he first got extubated.
Lisa: When I left the emergency room. Yes, he was.
Patrik: Right. He was in a position to have a conversation with you?
Lisa: Yeah.
Patrik: So, and, and nobody had the courtesy to ask your husband what he wants.
Lisa: The doctor asked if he wanted to be resuscitated if necessary. And he said, “Yes, do everything you can to keep me alive”.
Patrik: And they did the opposite.
Lisa: Yeah. And they didn’t even tell me that he had heart failure in the ER. And they had to do CPR on him for what, 10 or 11 days. He said that he wasn’t moving his arms and his legs and everything. He was moving them fine when I found out that they hadn’t given him an enema in 11 days. That’s why he was moving around and stuff. He got gut bubbles and stuff.
Patrik: So I would go as far as, I was talking about euthanasia a moment ago, but I would go as far as that, if your husband was able to voice his own wishes after extubation and they were giving him morphine, I wouldn’t even say this as euthanasia. I would go as far as to say that this is murder.
Lisa: Well, no, after they took the tube out, no, he couldn’t talk. He was laying there, but he knew what was going on, because he had a tear going down his cheek.
Patrik: Right.
Lisa: But he couldn’t talk.
Patrik: Right. And how long did it take then? How much more morphine did your husband get before things were happening?
Lisa: I believe, because then after I got mad that everything’s dropped on him, I believe I went out to smoke a cigarette real quick, and I wasn’t gone very long at all. And she called, “I think he’s going to pass in maybe a minute”. Ran up there and he was already gone.
Patrik: Oh my goodness. That is unbelievable. So basically, you are talking about hours?
Lisa: Yeah. He was breathing on his own from 11:30 to 16:51. I asked her, “Can you put a CPAP on him? Can you give him his oxygen?”, she said, “He wasn’t on oxygen”. I said, “Well, his oxygen was fine a minute ago and now it’s stopped”. She said, “That’s the direction we want to go”. I said, “Well, the doctor said, you can have a CPAP that you take him down stairs”, “No, ma’am that’s not where we’re going”. They were just out to kill
him.
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Patrik: That’s absolutely terrible. It’s heartbreaking to hear what’s happened here. And I want to reassure our listeners here that when hospitals ask about ending life, about withdrawing treatment, that most States in the U.S. and Australia, UK have laws that, in the absence of decision-making capacity for a patient, which was the case in your husband’s situation, that the medical power of attorney needs to agree to a withdrawal of treatment or to a hastening of death. And it sounds to me like that may not have been the case in this situation, but I do want to reassure our listeners that if you argue on that level with
hospital policies, as well as with state laws that are in place to protect patients, you should be successful. I guess, in your situation, Lisa, I guess you weren’t aware of your rights. Would that be fair to say?
Lisa: Yeah. And he painted the picture, “James is going to have a bleak future, he’s going to have to be put in a nursing home and always have that tube in”. And that wasn’t the case when you look at his blood test and everything, he was getting better. They were a lot better than when he went in. So to me, they’ve murdered him.
Patrik: Yeah.
Lisa: After he’s gone, there’s no bringing them back.
Patrik: Happened so quickly. And only in retrospect, did you find out that there would have been people that could have advocated on your behalf or if you had done more research you could have advocated for him, for yourself. I guess, you know what’s really important to hear or to understand here is that you as families or as patients have rights, you just need to exercise them. I guess, the other thing that is important to get from this situation
is it’s important to have paperwork in place with spouses. So it’s clearly documented who is a medical power of attorney so that there is no ambiguity when it comes to literally life or death decision-making, because that’s what it is. It’s life or death decision-making unfortunately.
Lisa: His son was with me. He was doing better and everything all the way up to the doctor contacted him. And then it was like a power trip. “He don’t want to be on the machine. He’s not going to have to be on the machine forever”. He will get better. They took the tube, but there was no mention of a CPAP or going downstairs or nothing like they’d said.
Patrik: Right. So you felt like they were misleading you.
Lisa: Yeah. And his doctor did a bit taking care of him all the way up to the last week he was out that week, because he was on vacation. This was all the doctors that had seen him since he started, was put in the hospital. This is the one over the head over the ICU and some new doctor that was first day in the ICU, in the hospital period. They didn’t know nothing about him.
Patrik: He was just a number for them.
Lisa: Yeah. The nurses every day would tell me, “Oh he’d squeeze my hand, he’d open his eyes”.
Patrik: Lisa, are you happy to share with our listeners how old your husband was?
Lisa: 56.
Patrik: Oh my goodness. That’s heartbreaking.
Lisa: And he was a good man, he was loved by a lot of people. I think the organ donors were waiting there. They said they weren’t going to take an organ, but then they sent him a medal saying that he had donated. So, I don’t know whether he did or not. They were waiting there too. And the ICU was not full. There were a bunch of empty rooms.
Patrik: Right. Unfortunately this is what happens in some ICU’s every day. Families being unaware of what options are, what rights they have, that there are experienced professionals that can advocate for them. But also, you have been misled, you didn’t even know that a tracheostomy was an option that would buy him time to get off the ventilator, potentially even go home with a service like intensive care at home. None of this was ever mentioned to you and your family.
Lisa: They were like, “Well, how are you going to pay for his care?”, I said, “I’m responsible for his hospital bill anyway. I’ll find way”. But I said, “I can take him home and take care of him at home”, “You can do that on your own”, “Why not”, “Well, you just can’t”.
Patrik: And they haven’t given him enough time to get better in the first place.
Lisa: No.
Patrik: So it’s really all we can learn from-
Lisa: Too bad he was up for two hours on his own. They took it out he was up from 11:30 to 16:51. I do believe she gave him more shots as soon as I walked out.
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Patrik: And Lisa, when did you realize… By what stage down the line after your husband had passed away, at what stage did you question or did you realize what was happening?
Lisa: Really, the night before they took the tube out I started, “What is going on here? Because doing a Google search on intubation and I come up with your website”, but I didn’t have enough time to learn anything and to be able to go in and say, “This is what’s going to happen now”. Then when you pass your essay was that by and I was like, “I got to learn more”. And I’ve watched all these YouTube… On YouTube there’s all kinds of videos on how to
intubate and what to do while they’re intubated and all that. None of that happened. Well, some of it happened, but a lot of it didn’t happen.
Patrik: Right? Lisa, I’m really heartbroken by listening to your story. And again, unfortunately this is not a novelty and I’m sure that some of our listeners can resonate with your story. But I also hope that somebody that has a loved one in ICU, this story can hopefully be a lesson for someone that has a loved one in ICU and be on high alert to question everything that the intensive care team is telling them and seek out-
Lisa: I was going two or three, four visits, whatever I could get into that day. And then I would call at night before I went to bed, I would call first thing in the morning to see how he’s feeling. And they told me to start keeping his blood pressures and stuff. So I started writing all that down.
Patrik: Right. Okay. Lisa. Keep an eye on everything and question. And talk to people that understand intensive care inside out so you can get a second opinion. You can have intensive care hotline.
Patrik: You can see from this situation it is literally a life or death situation. And what I’m always saying is it’s a once in a lifetime situation that you can’t really afford to get wrong. And this confirms that unfortunately.
Lisa: There’s no getting him back.
Patrik: No, there’s no turning back unfortunately. Lisa I’m conscious of the time and I am really appreciative that you managed to say at this very sad story with our listeners, hopefully as a warning for everyone that has a loved one in intensive care. That no matter how young patients are in intensive care, 56 is very young, that the intensive care team need space, doesn’t have enough staff, they need an organ donor. It could be all sorts of
things going on in the background that people are unaware of. Also, what I believe is happening in intensive care, as well… I do believe that intensive care professionals are desensitized. What I mentioned earlier is that your husband was just another patient in a bed. He was just a number. But it’s unfortunately patients are not numbers, they are individuals with families. They’re individuals with people that care deeply about them. Whereas in intensive care doctors, nurses, I believe I’d be
sensitized by people dying. And for them it’s just another death.
Lisa: Yeah. That’s what she acted like it’s not a big deal-
Patrik: No big deal-
Lisa: About the direction they want to go. You tell that to somebody that has a loved one that’s dying. It’s not right.
Patrik: No, it’s not right.
Lisa: And they let me walk out. After I went back up, thought he was dead and I fell on my knees and I was like, “No” and I got up. And they let me walk out of there hyperventilating.
Patrik: And just as a last question, before we try and wrap this up, Lisa. Did the hospital ever follow up with you or your family after your husband’s passing? Whether you’re okay? Did the hospital ever follow up with you?
Lisa: She sent me a sympathy… Just a blue card said, “Sorry, that your loved one passed away”, or they sent me that in the mail. That was it.
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Patrik: Right. Okay. That’s very sad. Lisa we need to wrap this up. I am really appreciating that you have taken the time and share this very sad story with our listeners hopefully as a warning and as a lesson so that our listeners can manage this differently if they find themselves in a similar situation. So thank you everyone. Thank you, Lisa, for coming on to this podcast. Thank you to our listeners for taking the time to listening to Lisa’s
story. Go and check out our blog intensivecarehotline.com, here you can get case studies, information, advice, advocacy for families in intensive care. Go and check it out. Thank you once again, Lisa, for coming on to this podcast and we’ll talk to you soon. Thank you, Lisa. Bye-bye.
Lisa: Thank you. Bye-bye.
Kind regards,
Patrik
