Hi, it’s Patrik Hutzel from INTENSIVECAREHOTLINE.COM where we instantly improve the lives for Families of critically ill Patients in Intensive Care, so that you can make informed decisions, have PEACE OF MIND, real power, real control and so that you can influence decision making fast, even if you’re not a doctor or
a nurse in Intensive Care!
This is another episode of “YOUR QUESTIONS ANSWERED” and in last week’s episode I answered another question from our readers and the question was
My Brother is Brain Dead in the ICU and the Doctor Wants to Pull the Plug Now. What Will I Do? Help!
You can check out last week’s question by clicking on the link here.
In this week’s episode of “YOUR QUESTIONS ANSWERED” I want to answer questions from one of my clients Camille, as part of my 1:1 consulting and advocacy service! Camille’s brother is brain dead in the ICU, and the doctor
wants to withdraw treatment. Camille is asking why she needs to change her approach towards the ICU team.
My Brother is Brain Dead in the ICU and the Doctor Wants to Withdraw Treatment. Why Do I Need to Change my Approach Towards the ICU Team?
“You can also check out previous 1:1 consulting and advocacy sessions with me and Camille here.”
Part 1
Patrik: But, that doesn’t neglect the fact that people have very different beliefs around what they think about this whole issue of brain dead beyond the medical fraternity.
Camille: Yes.
Patrik: Right?
Camille: I’m hoping that I can get to see him, or even getting a … I don’t know what to do, it’s just … it’s so scary. You know? It’s just like … because I think I definitely … if I need to call you back, is it possible? Could you talk to them on behalf?
Patrik: It is. No, I would talk to them. I would talk to them. I would be very happy to talk to them. Bear in mind, you know, if you do want me to talk to them, there’s a couple of things. Number one, I do charge a fee for that.
Camille: Okay.
RECOMMENDED:
Patrik: Number two, I am not … if somebody is brain dead, I would definitely … if you want me to work with you, I would definitely look … what my next … okay, if you wanted to engage me for this, my next step would be I would look up what the law says in North Dakota and you know, you can look that
up in this day and age, that’s not a big deal, you know?
Patrik: I would, I would definitely want to find out what else is happening in terms of clinical … you know, what else they are doing. In terms of their rights to withdraw treatment, I’m not sure where they stand with that, but we can certainly find out, right?
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: We can set that up. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. We can set that up in no time. Absolutely.
Camille: But like you told me not to go see them right now, but should I go and see them?
Patrik: Okay. Let’s … if you-
Camille: I mean not that you told me, you know I’m not trying to be like-
Patrik: So, no.
Camille: But I know there’s a time difference between talking to Thaddeus Pope so-
RECOMMENDED:
Patrik: Yeah. Let me ask you this, what would you have done without that phone call? What would have been your next course of action without that phone call?
Camille: I don’t know. I would just-
Patrik: Right. When would you have gone back to hospital?
Camille: Tonight. We go back late at night time when nobody’s there when all the doctors go home.
Patrik: Right. Yeah, I would probably stick with that. Go with … what’s your email address?
Camille: I sent it to you already.
Patrik: Yeah. Oh I think you are a subscriber to our email. You come up and you’ve had … right, and you’ve had a call booked at-
Camille: 6 o’clock.
Patrik: Yes, that’s right. Now you come up. Okay, sure. Yeah. Now you come up. Okay.
Camille: So that’s good to talk with you.
Patrik: Yes, that’s right. No it would have been 9 o’clock for me.
Camille: Okay well you know what, God puts you at the right time.
Patrik: Right.
Camille: Yeah.
Patrik: So what I’ll do Camille is I will email you the consulting options.
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: Right, and then you can choose from there, you know?
RECOMMENDED:
Camille: Okay cool.
Patrik: I am available.
Camille: So I tell them that you’re my cousin.
Patrik: Yeah, I think it’s the best … I’ll tell you what I find right?
Camille: Brother in-law.
Patrik: Yeah, brother-in-law, whatever, you know, it’s non-threatening and you know it … and don’t get me wrong, there are situations when I come in as a consultant and advocate, right?
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: But it’s got to be the right time and we can always change the script, you know if need be, right?
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: So what I will do is I will email you the consulting options, right?
Camille: Okay. That sounds good. Yeah, I know you guys are different hours over there too.
Patrik: That’s all right for me at 7:00 AM but it doesn’t matter you know?
Camille: Oh wow.
Patrik: Because I was on a call to Virginia at 5:00 AM my time. I’m talking to people in the U S every day.
Camille: I don’t know if I’ll be able to get through to Thaddeus Pope because over here in North Dakota it’s 4 o’clock, or 4:08 and so we’re-
Patrik: He’s in Minnesota.
RECOMMENDED:
Camille: He is in Minnesota? Okay.
Patrik: He’s in Minnesota, which would be … wouldn’t that be the same time zone?
Camille: I think so. I can try that and you can send me the form and then … and I can set it up for right now. See, because we’ve been living in a motel for six weeks.
Patrik: Right, oh my goodness.
Camille: Two rooms, you know, the family, my mother, my niece, my daughters, all three of us, you know, just … yeah.
Patrik: Horrible.
Camille: So it’s very expensive here.
Patrik: Yeah no, absolutely. Look, what I’ll do is I will email you the consulting options, you can check out … you can take it from there. Please keep in mind, I work on a first come first serve basis. You know, I’m busy.
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: You know, so the quicker … the sooner you book, you know, we can attend to it then very quickly.
Camille: Yes. But the problem is, is I don’t know when I’m going to meet with these doctors and that’s what I need you for meeting with these doctors.
Patrik: Okay I tell you … okay, do you remember what I said to you earlier? You need to change your whole approach. It’s not … You tell them when you meet them, you tell them, you need to change your whole approach.
RECOMMENDED:
Camille: Okay. Okay.
Patrik: You need to change your whole approach. You need-
Camille: I think that’s very important. Yeah.
Patrik: You will need to change your approach. You can’t be having them tell you what to do and what not to do. You will need to change your approach. Are you there?
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: Right. Are you there?
Camille: Okay so that’s very, very viable information right now, what you were saying, to change my approach.
RECOMMENDED:
Patrik: You need … look, I tell you one thing, Camille, and don’t misunderstand me and don’t get me wrong when I say this, you need to take responsibility for your outcomes.
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: Right?
Camille: Yeah.
Patrik: And look, you … you know, self-reliance starts with taking responsibility, and I’m not saying you’re not responsible, but because I know the bullying tactics of hospitals, you know, and intensive care units, in particular, part of the problem often is that families haven’t found a better way and that they haven’t changed their approach. That’s often part of the problem.
Camille: Yeah, exactly.
Patrik: Right. So what I’ll do Camille, I will send you those consulting options and you will-
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: You’ve got my number, you can dial that, the US number. It’ll always go to my cell phone.
Camille: Okay that’s great, and your name again was?
Patrik: Patrik.
RECOMMENDED:
Camille: Patrik. Okay Patrik, you know what? I’m really thankful to God for you. So what I’ll do is I can send you a text message saying, “Doctors are here in the room. They need to talk now,” or whatever.
Patrik: Yes, absolutely. Either that, send me a text message. I’m also on WhatsApp. I don’t know, are you on WhatsApp or Skype?
Camille: No. I don’t have WhatsApp here.
Patrik: That’s all right. Do you have Skype?
Camille: No, no I don’t have Skype.
Patrik: That’s okay, you can send me a text message. That’s okay. Look, I will email you the consulting options right now, okay?
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: And then you can take it from there.
Camille: Do they need to do another MRI also?
Patrik: We’re going to find that out. I don’t know. It depends. It depends on what they’ve done. I will find out on the call.
Camille: Okay, all right. That sounds great. Thank you so much.
Patrik: I will send you the consulting options now. Talk soon then.
Camille: Okay.
Patrik: Thank you.
Camille: Thank you Patrik.
Patrik: Thank you. Bye.
Camille: Bye.
RECOMMENDED:
Camille: Hello?
Patrik: Hi, Camille, it’s Patrik again. So when I dial this number, who will I get on the call, you think?
Camille: Aubrey.
Patrik: Aubrey. And she’s a nurse?
Camille: Yes. She’s the nurse.
Patrik: Okay. Yep. Just give me one sec. While I try to dial her in, you may not be able to hear me, I don’t know. Were you able to hear me earlier when I tried this other number?
Camille: No, I’m not sure.
Patrik: Right. Okay. No, that’s fine. So I may disappear for a moment while I’m trying to dial this other number. So just please bear with me. Hang on a sec. Hang on a sec. So hang on, because I’ve got the right… Hang on. Okay just-
Camille: So you can help me to make the decision, whatever needs to be done. For me, that’ll be a relief.
Patrik: Absolutely. So just bear with me please. I’ll just try and dial her in. Thanks.
Aubrey: Hello?
Patrik: Hello?
Camille: Hello? Hi, can I speak to Aubrey?
Aubrey: Hello? Hello. Can I help you? Oh, just a moment, please.
Patrik: So that that’s the right number you think? Okay, good, good. We’ll just wait then.
Patrik: And she called you a moment ago? Is that what you said?
Camille: She’s in a room, she’ll be right out. Can I put you on hold for a moment?
RECOMMENDED:
Camille: Yes. Okay. Thank you. Is everything okay?
Aubrey: With what, honey? Is everything okay with?
Patrik: Did you hear Camille that she asked you if everything is okay? Did you hear that?
Camille: Yeah.
Patrik: Right.
The 1:1 consulting session will continue in next week’s episode.
Kind Regards
